hilarious to me that people will resent a language or framework for a handful of quirks or "unique" patterns

yeah, give me a language or framework that doesn't

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express js .. it's a framework technically and u can create ur idea with complete freedom.

you mean something like vanilla js?
yeah, the whole thing is one huge ass quirk. And yet people still use it

@SidTheITGuy 😶

Patterns are only worth as much as the code you can write with them. Show me a use case or evolutionary step where pre-existing techinques would fail, until then it's unnecessary cognitive load.

Ruby, Python and some JS libraries do this a lot, there are 5 ways to express anything, two of those are more powerful and much longer, the rest are basically equivalent and only differ in keystrokes which aren't supposed to cost more than 250ms of dev time if the programmer is worth a fuck.

A language that has first-class functions does not need mixin syntax*, a mixin is literally just a function that receives your function as an argument. Middleware are also just functions, unless your middleware API exposes actions the event handler can't do.

* unless you're so fanatically allergic to delimiters that you rather accept lambdas that can't even bind local names than curly braces, like Python.

@kobenz no scheme slander

I can't think of one that would fit. They all have Quirks in one Shape or Form.

@SidTheITGuy yes its true, if you like callbacks piled on top of callbacks

yes, I know, you can organize stuff quite nicely with handlers and routers etc eventually, but for the newcomer it for sure looks very weird

@thebiochemic yeah, i definitely want to use something like C++ to do stuff on the web, big ecosystem for that

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i really just don't get the javascript haters when it's the only practical option for the web (PLEASE don't mention any obscure weird thing like WASM - though I know you javascript haters out there can't resist) but you know what, yeah javascript sucks, go build your production app with WASM, come back and check in in a few months

@fullstackcircus If you look at JS like a weird Lisp it's actually not that bad. I just don't get when people try to present faults in the language and its APIs as a "part of the design" and any abstraction built on top of them as inherently bad, as if the arbitrary combination of uncoordinated decisions by different people that defined the web held any value at all.

The nicest JavaScript code I have ever seen is in the JS edition of SICP

From the outside it looks silly to get hung up on a detail but when you're trying something new and get stuck with a seemingly insane detail it really does feel like "well if this one feature is THAT dumb and gross we can't even trust this project at all"

Because usually do you have a more familiar alternative to use instead.