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@Floydimus ooh doomsaying! A fellow ZHer if ever I saw one! I knew I liked you from the moment I met ya.
Ok, this is fun. My turn.
Tea leaves say: check back in six months.
Once you start reading enough the actual causes start to pop up on their own. It was like the tether scandal today. Same time btc was set to break its holding pattern. Conveniently killed the rally pretty fast didnt it?
Or how china and the u.s. use North Korea as neutral ground or a buffer because the fundamentals arent there yet to *profit* from a war on that scale, which tells you what Korea based threats actually are: cheap and easy playbook excuses for navy contractor largesse.
Or how autumn and all the shit that's about to hit the ceiling fan is really just a replay of the November 2019 overnight interbank repo crash.
It comes in fits and starts. Slowly. Then burst. Then all at once.
Like a dam, cracking at first, and then suddenly completely bursting. -
@Floydimus The USD is going to. But I suspect the USD has not been capitalism for a long time. I think it was only paid lip service. They want to move the system away from the petrol dollar. To what I don't know, but it will include people not owning their shirt. Either we stand up and start saying "Fuck You!" to these assholes or freedom is about over. France has the right idea. They wheeled out a guillotine in front of Marcon. Those people know how to party!
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The bigger picture in cities is also interesting. Shop owners fired employees during lockdowns to save cost because the shops have to keep paying the insane rents - just like the employees.
Tons of vacant buildings and STILL insane rents: market failure. No law of low demand, high supply leading to falling rents.
That's because the real estate is on credit, and the credit line is determined by the building value, which in turn is determined by the nominal rent. Lower the rent, and the value goes down so that the landlords would need to shoot in big money to their banks. Money that they don't have because the buildings are vacant.
That will become another financial crisis because we're talking mortgage backed assets, and that's e.g. part of pension funds.
What's more, large parts of the cities' tax renevue come from property tax, tied to the nominal building value. That will also go down with a market correction. -
@kwilliams in ten years time you will probably have eaten your rabbit. Never name them, thays what makes it hard.
Thanks for the read though. Glad you enjoyed. -
@Fast-Nop very concise breakdown FastNOP.
I assume that's what the BlackRock buying spree is about, along with the BnB/subletting rush: if the amount of house you're getting (square foot and number of rooms) is lower, and rent is lower per unit, but the *amount* of lots hasn't changed with the number of units, then you end up collecting *more* rent while nominally lowering the median across the board, yeah? -
@Wisecrack I doubt it is about the rent. Just like you don't buy stocks because of the dividend. It's probably using cheap FED printed money to buy shit.
They bet that the asset value will rise faster than the interest rates for the cheap lended money. That may be the classic speculative bubble bet, or a bet against the dollar. -
@Fast-Nop its telling that we haven't gone to war over Russia and China ruble/yuan-for-oil trades.
Dollar supremacy is nearly the only device propping up the entire facade.
Lot of stuff and food still made in america, and a lot of dollars still out there still floating in other nations reserves. If our ephemeral control of the middle east goes it would be bad. Makes me wonder about the Saudis deal and the pull out from Afghanistan. Might be as prep for defending Saudis. Or were genuinely just broke and the public doesnt support it enough to maintain the political will for it.
Or maybe I'm just reaching. -
@Floydimus
I doubt capitalism will collapse.
What we're currently seeing is a bit of a "class war", which happens every time there's a bunch of recessions, followed by a wave of automation, followed by economical recovery with no/not enough social redistribution of wealth.
The gap widens. Those who own the looms -> steam engines -> computers -> robots win, those whose jobs are replaced, get left in the mud.
But capitalism doesn't collapse.
Tensions rise. Riots happen. Civil war. Xenophobia. World war. Destruction. Cyber attacks. Nukes.
But capitalism.... Does. Not. Collapse.
It might reset a little. -
@bittersweet tell that to the mao and the soviets.
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@Wisecrack Both maoist China and the USSR collapsed back INTO capitalism.
Not saying capitalism doesn't have any issues. Capitalist economies tend to develop unacceptable cruelties.
I just think capitalism is the base state for society. Capitalism doesn't collapse, things collapse back into capitalism.
The state of a society tends to oscillate.
The period after a war is like a freshly erupted volcano. Chaos, but fertile ground for prosperity. Prosperity turns into corruption. Corruption to stagnation. Stagnation to austerity, austerity to optimization & automation, automation to disparity, disparity to war.
Classical liberalism makes the cycle faster, peaks more extreme: A well-oiled machine which turns citizens into fuel whenever the BTU value of their body exceeds their projected labor value.
Communism and to a lesser extent socialism makes the cycle slower, but doesn't increase "prosperity for all". It drags out corruption and stagnation, into a peaceful poverty. -
As such I believe in the value of a "social ordoliberalism" which seeks to optimize the Saez formula.
(https://eml.berkeley.edu/~saez/...)
Which knobs to turn to make society prosperous AND decrease income disparity isn't a subject of politics or opinion.
It's hard science.
Finding the apex optimum over the Saez formula is somewhat of an NP-complete/hard problem, but improvements can be found. -
@bittersweet mass murder is hardly peaceful poverty.
It *did* make those post soviet states more resilient though. -
@Floydimus it already did now it’s going to reset back to the beginning of the end so more stupid fools can be sucked in in slave conditions
I say this over and over and no one listens
Fix it so basic fucking necessities are provided
Freeze wages and prices
Make work actually reward with alllll disposable income
The auto payment
The vacation
The line of blow
The blow job
The lap dance
The new computer
The next installment of dawn of war
The trick bike
The camping gear
And create a shared work system for the absolute worst jobs and make employers relax their idiotic standards which now they just feign anyway
That a person who hasn’t worked for awhile is useless apparently or when human life happens that it’s a black mark for not giving head deeply and succulently enough instead of giving cushy jobs to energy vampires and letting people with a bare level concept of dignity suffer ! -
Bravo @wisecrack
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@YouAllSuck I read all your comments in edward nortons voice.
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@Wisecrack lmao ! Ty !
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@Wisecrack that is how I am presently feeling in a sense
Confused and worn down by an environment of people stuck in an endless loop that doesn’t inspire feeling so much as suspends it and doesn’t encourage mental health as they claim to be pursuing but creates a total lack of negative impulses and surrender to their worst attributes and oversimplifies everything and makes everything shit and all I want to do is blow it all up so people are
Forced to live again instead of being goddamn dead people that and I’m sick of being dragged into scenarios where I realize I’ve made a similar comment before instead of there just being permanence so most especially at my best years I’d have something to look forward too as I continued to mature instead of looking around at the walking dead -
@Wisecrack are you still alive ? If so prove it add
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@YouAllSuck You're gonna be fine guy.
Take you a break from society.
I recommend a log cabin and letter writing. Some interesting topics to write about include something about industrial society and its future. -
@Wisecrack if it were that easy or if people just gave up this fruitless pre trained crap they’ve been doing more and more Visibly in place of life refusing to add variance or tell the truth or really connect anymore I’d agree with you
The issue is people are not and it’s driving me insane
And I don’t mean routines I mean LITERALLY and I think I said this before and no this is not a game for me
I’m sick of this
And their normal action is not correcting anything
I feel like I’m stuck among aliens -
@Wisecrack I feel like i'm surrounded quite literally by people poorly emulating the struggles and lives of people who actually lived, when they never have. and it fucking freaks me out
it tinges every single moment with unnecessary anxiety and unhappiness and simulatenously not being able to view them as human because they do awful things when they're able, and i'm likely talking to them right now, i can't interact with them in anything but a standoffish way.
nor do i really want to. their secondary take on english is exxasperating.
their repetitiveness is exxasperating and while all people have routines etc we're not even talking about that because the background doesn't change and they place no value in anything anuone makes or creates and its not allowing anyone to change or grow, just get stuck in a consistent slow downward spiral.
and they seem to enjoy the idea of non hope. its ridiculous. -
@YouAllSuck Then go out and become an activist. What do you expect anyone to do or say to that?
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@Wisecrack I want and still want that cabin
but I want the world's contents to not be thrown in an attic for another however many years because people are intent on trapping themselves, then their will is eroded, and if its not they stir and repeat so frequently nothing seems to ahev any point because nothing is being allowed to lead to any gain ! and the point overall seems pretty simple and they're just not seeing it:
1. lie to stupid people
2. give them something very inexpensive monetarily that works out to 0 cost
3. get them to lie like everything is hunky dorey
4. get them trapped
5. get them dependent
6. sedate their emotions
7. wear away their core human characteristics which die very slowly with age while they do not advance as people or change their mode of life or thinking or learn anything new or rewire themselves in any positive way
8. make everything impossible.
9. introduce more fools the same way who think the same way
10. ruin their children so they end up like them -
@Wisecrack
11. remove all independence, remove all sources of recovery or help
12. spread cynical ideas or attitudes
13. enlist the help of people who are by and large, derelicts to form a basis
14. ruin people like life is cheap and let this be part of what feeds the whole circular process
15. destroy confidence in help or higher powers
16,. spread atheism
17. turn people off to any established cultural norm
18. tempt people with things they need
19. browbeat through superior numbers people into accepting this shit
20. keep them prisoner from fear of losing what they have
21. slowly grind them into the cycle till their ability to think or feel disappears and they forget what living is like. -
@Wisecrack oh and to the activist part
1. make all social causes a joke
2. keep people busy with excuses and diversiosn
3. keep things jussstt bearable enough to prevent revolt
4. create the perception that all activism is is silly and create the wrong goals slowly using sophisms and half truths so that people lose all belief in the cause and go back to being quiet
5. sew confusion of self identity for jollies
6. destroy the happiness of decent people through the sack of shit precepts
7. remove all possibility of change by keeping everyone complacent through all the other things mentioned
8. ensure that people who would do this and try end up wasting their time and ending up with nothing to create roman examples
9. stir and repeat until everyone is integrated into the same bullshit system that reduces human value to nothing
10. infiltrate alllll of these causes with people who do not believe in them or care about them at all and speak hypocritically to sabotage.. -
@Wisecrack and i remember you caustically remarking in some way, no i'm not shy, but i do not trust the garbage on two legs and you still have not done anything new since last time. except avoid making a loud mouthed annoying chommy remark that makes me want to slap you :)
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@Wisecrack feel dead yet ? you should.
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@Wisecrack and industrial society has no future. it just has its past. invention and r&d has slowed, and we're writing off the negative effects because improving everything costs too much money.
so. collapse either through widespread health issues which we are seeing presently and have seen or through lack of sustainability and/or morale. -
@YouAllSuck first I object to your insinuations and your general demeanor.
Second, that's a good list of problems with society. You do better with lists than with paragraphs, and are you're a lot more coherent.
Third, I've never insulted you that I know of. I actually enjoy your off the wall posts.
If it bothers you people dont take your posts too seriously, you gotta reevaluate, its the internet dude. -
@YouAllSuck "and they seem to enjoy the hopelessness."
Some do enjoy being hopeless. Broadly speaking it's easier to tune things out, to not care, than get up in arms about anything, when presented with the option of action vs apathy, and so most people choose apathy.
And the more intense you are about caring, the more it turns some people off. People are strange like that.
Unless you have say, your own news network, to act as a megaphone. -
@Wisecrack honestly typos and knee jerk reactions are kind of the effect of SociaL
Media and typing on a mobile device heh
I’m glad you like my posts
That keep repeating with variations
As I still think of myself as alive
If stuck among insane insanely monstrous people on the midnight train to a spot called nowhere which is actually a suburb of the lowest layer of hell -
@Wisecrack the hopelessness factor is often they are happy to be hopeless seeing other people who are hopeless because it makes them feel responsible
I don’t know if I posted this response but I sure as hell did the other and it stands to reason my thought process would not change
We are living in a time I thought the description of a lie
Where the enemy was very busy corrupting and destroying the young well now they’re grown
And many betrayed their siblings to avoid their own abuses and took to a let the other person catch the abuse not me approach in the worst of scenarios
It’s sad but sadder still that that cancer matastisized in their warped personalities
My scenario is not a happy one atm
I may never reach that cabin in comfort
I have such a simple bucket list really
I want life in a sane place a little nookie and time to heal when is that going to happen ? Who the duck knows -
@YouAllSuck I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say what I'm thinking, and I want you to correct me if I'm wrong, ok?
I think you are suffering, crom some real anxiety. Your obviously highlg intelligent and maybe you are suffering in some other areas as well.
If I got anything wrong, again, feel free to correct it.
Now I'm going to suggest something you maybe arent too keen on but which really helped a couple of people I know. 1. Get some sort of diagonosis. If you cant afford it, there are clinics that will do it for free. Dont hesistate. It seems impossible, I know. Once you do get diagnosed try to get a recommendation for either proponol (works actual god damn miracles for anxiety according to a friend, and is nonaddoctive. And its effects lasted even after he stopped taking it). -
2. In addition to the above (or if it is simply impossible because of your situation), take hypnotherapy. Do ot. It absolutely works. That and/or Cognitive behavioral therapy. A friend of mine was severely shy. Like "cant even go outside for weeks at a time" levels of shy. They can barely say hi to their neighbor. And hypnotherapy massively toned down their anxiety, and unblocked what was holding them back all this time. Try it. Theres even self hypnosis which also works from what I understand.
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@Wisecrack oh I know my issues
I am suffering from the side effects of continually being re exposed in my adulthood to the personality types related to people who victimized me my childhood and having muddled memories of time periods segmented by hope destroying trauma and wastes of time by fucked up people who deny even themselves who have taken over my country quietly
This being the worst for me in an area that is under control or previously was by the cartel who may or may not have yoked an area heavily in the sex and drug trade who i believe are now being impersonated when they’re visible as a sort of coint shield along with many other layers of redirection who own the local law enforcement and have hollowed out all government offices in this region where the breaks in my memory are derived from a natural childhood reaction to complete world and life changing and perception poisoning events which is continually exploited by the same group of people who are -
@Wisecrack utilizing an all inclusive strategy of running a self contained organization that gradually grows and isolates people in their population that were raised to be normal and decent
And the problem Is I don’t accept their gilded cage And sloppy second offerings as this just continues their activities and validates their system
Annnnnd you said that before so case in point -
@Wisecrack and so yes I know what I need to be better they just don’t care
They rape and sell their own children into the sex trade
And my father was from the boomer generation the actual one so he was more like a trade favor typ
That being said they are the worst kind of garbage -
@Wisecrack and evidenced by the fact that we are here speaking again and they’re still being dirty monsters not much has changed
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@Wisecrack eventually all such individuals will wish for death
Trust me -
@Wisecrack i already remembered what happened to me
All of it -
@YouAllSuck wait you in Mexico or south america or something?
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@Wisecrack the cartel did most of its business in the USA before it was subsumed
Central and south America are dirt poor -
@Wisecrack and now you understand why i mistook weird people for social engineers heh
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@Wisecrack so are you alive ?
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@YouAllSuck I'm actually a bot.
Jk.
But yeah theres a lot of social engineers and social engineer funnels out there.
I just try to liven up places with shitposting.
What do you do? -
@Wisecrack for a living ?
I work for the cia lol -
@YouAllSuck no, never seen anyway die, not in-person anyway. I've known a few people that died though.
You? -
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@YouAllSuck you might just be really good at predicting people's language patterns from previous posts.
Or you know it could be a ground hog day scenario. Jk.
Continous deja vu can also be a symptom of dysfunction in your temporal right frontal lobe (I think it's that one, cant remember for shit).
Worlds kinda brutal right now. Absolutely disengage from news. It sounds like its killing you. I dont know if I can say were friends, but as an acquaintance, do yourself a real favor and get away from news fro a while man. -
@molaram Even though "survival of the fittest" is cruel, and causes suffering which I think we should actively address as a species, it's not an experiment. It's the base modus operandi of the natural world.
The hardest working squirrel gathers the most nuts for winter, the beehive which gathers all the nectar survives. Others die.
Socialism exists in nature only on a small scale: Animals share food and offer protection only to their direct family or social group.
Does that mean we should be a cruel species?
Of course not.
We can choose to address whatever we perceive as injustices. We can donate money to a stranger who got sick, or even vote for solid public healthcare laws.
But it's not the natural state of things, the social aspects of society is something we as humans need to actively maintain.
Harsh capitalism is the fallback — in a post apocalyptic scenario with food shortages, humans are not very likely to give away their bread beyond their direct social group. -
@bittersweet Capitalism isn't the fallback - market / barter economy is. That's a big difference.
The hallmark of capitalism is that things stop revolving around real goods, and you use money to make money. Money itself becomes the dominant good. The amount of virtual transactions outclasses the real economy by orders of magnitude today.
Another important thing is that capitalism is against market economy - because the concentration process leads to monopolies. That's why we have antitrust laws, to protect market economy from capitalism. -
@molaram Socialism has failed even faster. Wherever socialism ruled or rules, you have closed borders to keep the socialist inmates from fleeing. Closed borders as in minefields, auto-guns, all that crap. That tells a lot about how bad it is.
The people who think socialism is a good idea are only those who have never lived in that kind of nation prison. -
@Wisecrack no it’s that people are being very repetitive
When we’re 40 going on 80 there will be no lies anymore
Im truly aghast that people have let this get this far in the first place -
@Wisecrack but anyway
What I was saying about that one area the structure is more complex and universal than that
See even if that org is calling the shots it’s a wide array of USA families in on the same thing
They are the visible ones and of course the number of dirty officials we have here is beyond counting now or fake people who in many cases as I said have the sole purpose of disguising who is really pulllinh the strings -
@Wisecrack if you’d asked me when I could as actually this age if I thought just living like an ordinary man would be something so difficult I’d have said no immediately but damaged people are everywhere now and have been essentially engineered as such
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@Wisecrack it is a complicated thing
But the basis is really simple like a corporation training a bunch of identical people with identical simplified skills for simplified purposes -
@Wisecrack and they are fairly bold despite the fact that this gets them hurt very frequently but of course this gets covered up by controlling what they see and their tastes in the case of these ruined people leans towards enjoying vicarious death as they suffer from the ordinary characteristic of never thinking the worst will reach them although I’d say this is pretty fucking bad
So picture an army of table scrap pilfering perverts and pretty much you have the rank and file -
@Wisecrack anyway in between garbage that willfully denies everything like some people
Who make excuses for what others see which are numerous for some reason
It’s a linked series of behavioral precedents and responses that makes everything behave this way
Contained also by people following their necessities and wants that makes this large scale mindless repetition possible along with a. Class of people who don’t actually remember things after a certain point as a self defense mechanism against the trauma these people cause
And then of course they’ll even go so far as trying to be impotently cruel by even using nicknames that are themselves messages to troll specific people because that would just seem like that person being nuts
Offline and online the system is about the same as everything is repetitive human interaction
That creates responses -
@Wisecrack anyway there are certain people on here I identify readily as utter trash
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@molaram yeah wouldn’t that be nice
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@molaram Ultimately, the whole Western civilisation will collapse - just like all the others before. That will lead to another dark age of a few centuries before something new arises, as before.
Specifically for capitalism, it needs periodic system resets. The main issue is credit interests if they are above inflation. You either can print money and do a currency reset, or you increase economy. The problem with the latter is that infinite growth doesn't work on a finite planet.
Though these resets don't necessarily mean a total system crash. Germany had two, counting the eastern ex-commie part even three currency reforms in the 20th century, for example. The fallout could be distributed by forcing e.g. asset owners to take new currency debt on their property, as done in Germany for real estate owners after WW2. -
@molaram do state run oligarchies really count as capitalism though?
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@molaram I've come to think of it as a false dichotomy.
Instead, remove left vs right, capitalism is communism, and start two two new axis, "market degrees of freedom", and "social control/authoritarianism"
For the market, you have: distributed vs concentrated.
Likewise for social control: distributed vs concentrated.
Simplifies and removes notions about definitions and variations "capitalism vs markets, bolshevism vs socialism, communism vs democracy" etc. -
@molaram more killing of the upper class schweinhund and less yapping, i'm 50 something now at 40 and i'm not getting any younger.
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@YouAllSuck meep
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@Wisecrack I've made a video of your rant :D Hope you'll share it and leave a comment: https://youtu.be/_zo7mMeH2xU
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@Floydimus sure?
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@sinisimattia you bet
Related Rants
This sums up the corporate world
Minimum wage employers and restaurants asking "and why should we hire you?".
You have 40 vacancies in your area for just your company alone.
You're paying $13.25 an hour when only a year ago you were paying $9.75.
Why should we hire you?
F*ck you, pay me, that's why.
You're not f*cking NASA
You're a God damn chain restaurant with a 40% turnover rate, who's employees probably shoot up in the bathroom on the rare occasion they even get a break.
I looked at the guy with all the annoyance I could muster, stared him down for a good five seconds and said. "You pay a few dollars over minimum. You're job is not important enough to even ask that question. Have a nice day." And got up and left.
Dude followed me and stuttered " hold up. I was just..."
But I was already out the door.
You were just what mark? Asking a dumbfuck question as if you had any leverage at all?
Your competitor *across the street* is offering 50 cents *more* per hour, and has guaranteed breaks.
What, did you forget 2008 and how you treated millions of people as disposable? The little part where you and most american industries demanded passion, without pay raises? Promotions without benefits? The jobs that if you worked hard, rather than a promotion or a pay raise, your reward was more work and less hours to finish?
You assholes thought we forgot about that? How you shipped millions of jobs overseas, blamed it on "automation" (chinese and indian slave labor), and then pointed the finger at millions of impoverished people as "lazy" in places like Detroit and Pittsburgh and told them "you just got to work harder and smarter!" Or "just get a small loan and create the next google!" from the comfort of your yachts? I'm looking at you bane corp.
No, now the shoes on the other foot motherf*ckers. Hows it feel needing all *us* commoners? "Why should we hire you?"
No, why should *I* WORK FOR YOU?
Cuz I saw THREE dirty tables coming in. A line of people that could be being served. A line that could have been optimized with the proper table count and some simple changes. A menu that doesnt even incentivize your biggest sellers and a dozen other things your store is doing wrong.
Think mark, think!
This is one of those braindead questions employers paying sub $18 an hour ask, because they suffered so much brain drain from years of payola profits from too-big-to-fail wallstreet bailouts, that they forgot they are not king midas, unless they are the king midas of shit, because increasingly everything corporate America touches turns into shit.
And while were on the subject, stopping bringing in outside management to stores. It destroys team cohesion, staff morale, pisses off people *on site* who *actually know* the team, the stores daily activities and processes, and who are better fit for that role. You bring in disinterested outside management, and it's one of the biggest red flags I've ever seen: these smarmy selfcongratulating f*cks who know nothing about the particular store, have no connection to the staff, go on firing sprees or alienation-sprees to hire in friends, fuck up the schedules because again they know nothing about the employees, and then move on after a few years to greener pastures, leaving a barren radioactive wasteland of chain smokers and burnt out staff in their wake.
Dear corporate America, your free ride on the public's good will is over. It's over.
Now you're in the bitch seat. Come sit at my desk and explain to me, EXPLAIN TO ME, why I should sweat and labor to save your shitty company hemorrhaging money like a bleeding crack-addicted hobo dying with a sucking chest wound from a chicago skidrow friday-night drive-by?
You dont deserve it. Your management and company culture is worse than incompetent. It's full of smiley guys expounding about their passion for customer service while giving each other sloppy BJs in broom closets, a veritable cornucopia of cult-like corporate dick suckers *and* dickheads, proclaiming, no...PROFESSING (hence "professional") their undying allegiance and dedication to their corporate family with the intensity of cujo, foaming at the mouth, or Mitt Romney preparing for a photoshoot, plastic smiles and feigned laughs.
Dont forget to wipe your chin, asshole. It's not Ronald McDonald your blowing, but it's definitely not Gordon f*cking Ramsey either.
Would you like fries with that?
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